Friday, September 23, 2005

To Be or Not To Be, That is the Agnostic's Question

Agnostics are the fence sitters in the freethinking community. They are of the opinion that since we can’t prove God exists, and we can’t prove that he doesn’t exist, they will just not make a choice. When asked if there is a God, they say, “I don’t know.”

I have said before that the difference between atheists and agnostics is that agnostics have questioned their faith, and atheists just thought about it a little longer. There are people who remain agnostic because they continue to stand by the belief that we can’t prove or disprove God’s existence. There is a major flaw in this thinking.

What if I told you that I had a goblin living in my closet? He turns invisible when other people go near him, so I am the only one who sees him. I can’t take a picture of him because he doesn’t show up on film. Sometimes he takes one of my socks and hides it. He also sings silly songs while I’m trying to sleep, but I’m the only one that can hear him.

Now, for anyone to believe me, I would have to prove that the goblin exists. I claimed it was true, so the burden of proof is on me. There is absolutely no evidence that a goblin exists outside of my imagination. Telling someone else to prove me wrong is just silly. I could make up anything that can’t be proven wrong. Prove that there are no invisible pink unicorns or psychic abilities.

An agnostic would have to accept all these things at ‘maybe true’ without making decisions on any of them. They can look at the world around them and see absolutely no evidence supporting the belief of goblins, unicorns, psychic abilities, or God. Why automatically assume that something may be true just because someone else said so? How about telling the claimants to prove it, since there is no reason to believe it in the first place.

My guess is that with religion, they just want to appear neutral and not cause waves when the discussion comes up. The truth is that they probably don’t believe.

9 Comments:

At 2:35 PM PDT, Blogger Raj said...

One: Agnostics are purely rational. Someone who is leaning, even slightly, to one side or another is not Agnostic.

Two: Agnosticism is defined with respect to a phenomenon that can NEVER be experienced by anyone. A person can believe or disbelieve in God, but he will never experience or know God. That is what Agnostics believe.

Unfortunately, given the human tendency towards hallucinations, they will always be a rapid pack of individuals asserting that they have experienced God.

All things said, Agnosticism is a defeatist attitude. We might not be able to prove/disprove God's existence at the moment, but we might be able to do so in the future. Remember, we are mere infants in the cradle of this universe. Hallucinations aside, if God does exist we will eventually find the SOB.

Cheers!
Raj.

http://thoughtsofaman.blogspot.com

 
At 3:07 PM PDT, Blogger The 502 said...

Hi Raj,
Thanks for stopping by. I still don't understand why agnostics are willing to accept that God is even a possibility. When one person makes a wild claim without evidence, there is no reason to believe that it is possibly true. When millions of people make the same claim, it doesn't make it any more possible.

 
At 5:07 PM PDT, Blogger David Amulet said...

Great post! I think it is similar to the ancients. Take the Greeks--they had their gods, and I am sure many of them believed .. for a while. As their knowledge increased, and the unexplainable became understood without resort to the supernatural, the gods remained ... but belief dropped off.

I think something similar is going on now. You called it right--many agnostics simply want to avoid the stigma of atheism as we go through the civilizational transition.

All the papal blabbering about the sin of secualrism will not change that transition. But we still do have some scary freaks out there, my friend, as I recently wrote about myself on my blog (article entitled "Witnessing, Groin Pains, and the Road to Hell"). Normally I shy away from the religious topic ... but what I saw one day on TV required a smart-ass response!

Keep the good stuff coming!

David Amulet

 
At 7:06 PM PDT, Blogger The 502 said...

Hi David,
I'm glad you liked my blog. I checked out the post you had your blog. Good stuff. I heard that Mikey Seaver had found religion, but I didn't know he was being annoying about it. I checked out their site, and what a shock, I'm a sinner! Proud of it, too. :)

 
At 7:29 PM PDT, Blogger David Amulet said...

HA! Coincidence--I was flipping channels today and saws another one of Kirk Cameron's proselytizing diatribes. Yikes.

I'd like to think he's just acting ... but he never was that good of an actor. WWJD? He'd kick Kirk Cameron's ass is what he'd do.

d.a.

 
At 1:09 AM PDT, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Actually, a person who does not believe in one or more gods is BOTH an Atheist AND an Agnostic.

And intelligent critically thinking people know this.

An Atheist does NOT BELIEVE in
a god or gods.

An Agnostic says there is NO WAY to KNOW if there is a god or gods.

Please note one word is KNOW & the
other is BELIEVE.

These words do NOT counterdict
one another at all.

I AM an Agnostic, Athiest and I am glad some others
know they are as well.

Neil C. Reinhardt

religionsucks@webtv.net

 
At 1:07 PM PDT, Blogger The 502 said...

Neil,
You are correct. I had thought about this post a bit more in the past week and came to the same conclusion.

Usually, when I meet an agnostic, they don't say whether they are a theist or an atheist. By saying they are ONLY agnostic, I put them into the category of irrationally neutral. I see now that this isn't their position of whether or not there is a god. Instead, it is their way of avoiding the question.

Being a theist or an atheist is seperate from being gnostic or agnostic. Being gnostic is only a choice for theists. Being agnostic is a default position for atheists.

From now on when someone tells me they are agnostic, but don't say whether they are an atheist or not, I will push the issue.

Thanks for taking the time to read my blog.

 
At 5:11 PM PDT, Anonymous reluctant atheist said...

Hi The 502:

Despite my handle, I am indeed an atheist.
I am a minimalist, this defines my viewpoint: if the positive cannot be proven, the negative is given.
I adhere to the Aristotelian dictum of the 5 senses. I cannot touch, taste, see, hear, or smell divinity. Ergo, zero.
There ARE indeed some things that are black and white. I feel this is one.

 
At 7:59 PM PDT, Blogger The 502 said...

Hi Reluctant,
I'm glad you stopped by. I am not familiar with Aristotle's thoughts yet, but they sound good so far. Basically, I agree with Objectivist views, which say the same thing. Reality is perceived through our senses. If we don't perceive it, it isn't there.

 

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